Moxie's Movie Reel

[Kieran]

Casting is one of those things where I give directors the BOD per their vision. A casting is something I decide on upon seeing the final product. Way too much politically obsessed viewers screaming “it’s Woke! It’s woke!!” When a non White is cast in a role. It’s almost comical to me.

If the casting is also politically obsessive, then I think that actually can be woke and detracts from the quality of the directors “vision.”

For “Amadeus” does anyone reallly think the play is more than a highly imaginary & fictional picture of Mozart & Salieri ( 2 real life figures). I mean to me the greater themes of “Amadeus” is Salieri’s spite toward God for gifting a young, brash & uncultured punk with the greatest musical gifts as a sort of cosmic joke.

Absolutely, and it’s staggeringly great in that regard.

In THAT context, why not have an Asian in the role?

Or, why have an Asian in the role? You’ve already caused a distraction from the play by pretending Mozart was a “brash uncultured punk”, why go further to force us to imagine him as an Asian? I get it that Amadeus is a fictional account that has no actual basis in reality, but why break the fourth wall even more by denying he was Austrian? Who is Amadeus then, in this play? Not Mozart, because Mozart was white. So why not cast a white actor and keep the focus on the character, not on the casting?

Or else why not go the full hog and rewrite the play to reflect only the grand themes, but base it around a fictional Asian composer, if you want so badly to cast an Asian, and call it after the Asian composer?

I think it’s disrespectful to both the audience and actually to Mozart to be so dismissive of his identity.

Younger generations who are used to ethnicity in all walks of life won’t give a crap and it fits IMO the true themes & visions of the play. ( how many people suspended belief in having white actors play ethnic roles in the past?) But of course we all decide for ourselves.

They will give a crap if you cast a white man playing a famous black person these days, they might even have a mostly peaceful riot.

On the other hand, what is accurate casting per intent? , in Shaespeare’s time women were prohibited from being on stage so all the great women roles he wrote (Juliet, Viola, Lady Macbeth, were played by men, would we say his intent & vision did not come through because a different gender literally played those roles in his lifetime?

No, I think his vision has won in the end. In those days people just had to imagine the man was a woman. In ancient times the actors wore masks that represented the character/god/demon they played. There has been historically a tremendous waste of women’s talents in the arts, which we hope to balance now. But in our times, we’re more used to realistic portrayals. Going back in time to anachronistic casting due to largely political ideas (bad ones) isn’t progress.

Or the fact that a Black actor first portrayed Othello 250 years after the play was initially staged. Did Shakespeare even envision a non white actor as the Moorsman? One could argue he never intended a black actor to ever play the role. Despite the theme of Othello as an outsider in a world where he never will be totally accepted. So is it so so horrible that Black actors play the role despite the possible preconceptions of the original writer?

Again talking about accuracy in casting is a very tricky subject.

IMO

We’ll never know what Shakespeare imagined for the future casts of his plays, unfortunately, and he lived in a time where it was dangerous to go against the grain. It’s a very interesting discussion though!

 

[the AntiPusher]

Now, I would say to this that all these characters in Oppenheimer actually existed, did they? So it completely limits any opportunity for enforced “diversity”, though that probably wouldn’t stop some people. I see there was a version of Amadeus where Mozart was played by an Asian actor. The problem with this is that it’s anachronistic, it breaks the the fourth wall and distracts from the story, as much as if he composed his great music in the show on a Casio.

As well as being highly unnecessary, it’s completely dishonest.

But my problem with the casting in The Odyssey - and I know you didn’t mention me, but this is an interesting and polite discussion - was the casting in general. All the actors were good but the film wasn’t Jason Bourne and The Argonauts. The almost completely American cast - and certainly completely non-Greek cast - was an absolute impediment to me getting immersed in the idea that we’re in the Bronze Age. I wish he’d gone full Mel Gibson and cast locals, speaking in their own tongue, or even in Ancient Greek, and we follow it in subtitles. It would have been more interesting, and if peak Mel Gibson directed it, it would definitely have been more visceral.

I think Nolan made a few major characteristics missteps with this film…

Hmmmm

 

[Federberg]

I'm going to say something that will probably shock a lot of you. But yesterday I went to watch the new Spiderman movie, Brand New Day. It was BETTER than Odyssey. It had more depth to it, the story was coherent and some of the acting was excellent. There was pathos, there was humour, there was irony. It worked! And I'm not a huge superhero movie fan. Normally I end up falling asleep. But this one was good, from start to end. It won't get as much hype, general or artistic, but by damn that was a better movie than Odyssey. I would be more willing to recommend people go and watch Brand New Day and feel confident that my taste in movies won't be devalued. And I'll stand on that

 

[Federberg]

Casting is one of those things where I give directors the BOD per their vision. A casting is something I decide on upon seeing the final product. Way too much politically obsessed viewers screaming “it’s Woke! It’s woke!!” When a non White is cast in a role. It’s almost comical to me.

For “Amadeus” does anyone reallly think the play is more than a highly imaginary & fictional picture of Mozart & Salieri ( 2 real life figures). I mean to me the greater themes of “Amadeus” is Salieri’s spite toward God for gifting a young, brash & uncultured punk with the greatest musical gifts as a sort of cosmic joke. In THAT context, why not have an Asian in the role? Younger generations who are used to ethnicity in all walks of life won’t give a crap and it fits IMO the true themes & visions of the play. ( how many people suspended belief in having white actors play ethnic roles in the past?) But of course we all decide for ourselves.

On the other hand, what is accurate casting per intent? , in Shaespeare’s time women were prohibited from being on stage so all the great women roles he wrote (Juliet, Viola, Lady Macbeth, were played by men, would we say his intent & vision did not come through because a different gender literally played those roles in his lifetime?

Or the fact that a Black actor first portrayed Othello 250 years after the play was initially staged. Did Shakespeare even envision a non white actor as the Moorsman? One could argue he never intended a black actor to ever play the role. Despite the theme of Othello as an outsider in a world where he never will be totally accepted. So is it so so horrible that Black actors play the role despite the possible preconceptions of the original writer?

Again talking about accuracy in casting is a very tricky subject.

IMO

I think the whole issue about casting was more of a thing for those who like to politicise everything on social media. Most posters here just thought it was overhyped while being an "ok" movie. Not something that's going to stand the test of time like a Gladiator or Casino. Nothing wrong with that. Not being a cheerleader for a so so movie is not a political stance. It's just... normal? Personally I was completely unbothered by the casting. I actually thought Lupita was good. Travis Scott as the Bard? Not so much.

 

[the AntiPusher]

I think the whole issue about casting was more of a thing for those who like to politicise everything on social media. Most posters here just thought it was overhyped while being an "ok" movie. Not something that's going to stand the test of time like a Gladiator or Casino. Nothing wrong with that. Not being a cheerleader for a so so movie is not a political stance. It's just... normal? Personally I was completely unbothered by the casting. I actually thought Lupita was good. Travis Scott as the Bard? Not so much.

Gladiator was Fantastic.. the original Amadeus with Tom Hulce as the lead was a masterpiece. I think he was robbed of the Academy award because he was in the wrong category. Now here is where I think if that movie came out now he would win because the Academy which is controlled by LBGT!Q movement and Hulce identified as a gay man although he has not came out completely. Casino didnt really move the needle for me.. I thought Stone and Joe Pesci was excellent. typical Deniro role..

 

[Jelenafan]

I'm going to say something that will probably shock a lot of you. But yesterday I went to watch the new Spiderman movie, Brand New Day. It was BETTER than Odyssey. It had more depth to it, the story was coherent and some of the acting was excellent. There was pathos, there was humour, there was irony. It worked! And I'm not a huge superhero movie fan. Normally I end up falling asleep. But this one was good, from start to end. It won't get as much hype, general or artistic, but by damn that was a better movie than Odyssey. I would be more willing to recommend people go and watch Brand New Day and feel confident that my taste in movies won't be devalued. And I'll stand on that

What’s so shocking about that? Movies stand on their own, regardless of genre.

As to hype & buzz , I believe this “Spider-Man” here in the US opened to the largest .grossing opening day of all time, close to 170 million on Friday alone, and is projected to be either the 1st or at worst 2nd highest domestic box office gross weekend ever here.

So it’s not exactly flying under the radar, plus it’s provably the best reviewed super hero film since “The Black Panther.” IMO it’s a very good film.

 

[Federberg]

What’s so shocking about that? Movies stand on their own, regardless of genre.

As to hype & buzz , I believe this “Spider-Man” here in the US opened to the largest .grossing opening day of all time, close to 170 million on Friday alone, and is projected to be either the 1st or at worst 2nd highest domestic box office gross weekend ever here.

So it’s not exactly flying under the radar, plus it’s provably the best reviewed super hero film “The Black Panther.” IMO it’s a very good film.

maybe I haven't been bombarded with marketing or hype for it on this side of the pond then, or I just don't have the tv on enough. For what it's worth I didn't think too much of Black Panther. That's one movie, like Coming to America that I simply can't understand what all the excitement is about. Seemed to me the concept of an advanced Black Country was more captivating that the actual acting and story line, but probably just me. This Spiderman though... I was impressed

 

[the AntiPusher]

maybe I haven't been bombarded with marketing or hype for it on this side of the pond then, or I just don't have the tv on enough. For what it's worth I didn't think too much of Black Panther. That's one movie, like Coming to America that I simply can't understand what all the excitement is about. Seemed to me the concept of an advanced Black Country was more captivating that the actual acting and story line, but probably just me. This Spiderman though... I was impressed

I think because of #45/47 dividing the country both socially and politically that made the movie Black Panther so popular.. Chadwick Bosman and Michael B Jordan was amazing. It couldnt have been two better actors who could have pulled off those performances that would have resonated with the community better. Personally I liked Captain America Civil War better as a movie but BP was really good and could have been epic but not the greatest. As for Spiderman the country is starving for a good movie and the theater are so thirsty for a hit they have some areas moving showing at 6 am. that's insane

 

[Murat B.]

I think because of #45/47 dividing the country both socially and politically that made the movie Black Panther so popular.. Chadwick Bosman and Michael B Jordan was amazing. It couldnt have been two better actors who could have pulled off those performances that would have resonated with the community better. Personally I liked Captain America Civil War better as a movie but BP was really good and could have been epic but not the greatest. As for Spiderman the country is starving for a good movie and the theater are so thirsty for a hit they have some areas moving showing at 6 am. that's insane

I think Tom Cruise would have made a great Black Panther.... You just have to "re-imagine" it .

 

[Jelenafan]

I think Tom Cruise would have made a great Black Panther.... You just have to "re-imagine" it .

Have him go on a tanbooth for a couple of weeks and call the movie “The Beige Panther”, it could work !

 

[the AntiPusher]

I think Tom Cruise would have made a great Black Panther.... You just have to "re-imagine" it .

Tom Cruise best role to me was Vincent in Collateral.. As a matter of fact.. I have some friends in law enforcement who teaches gun control and they show scenes from the movie when the hired killer assassinates someone. Similar to Val Kilmer's character Chris is using the assault weapons in the bank heist the military uses that for tactical training. Cruise was great until they turned him into a cartoon killer type at the end of the movie.

 

[Jelenafan]

Dang the Spider-Man movies box office grosses are really impressive

Within 4 days of release it will already gross worldwide over 1 billion …

‘Spider-Man: Brand New Day’ Soars to $355M for Second-Biggest Opening Weekend Ever

Tom Holland and his friends scored the highest-grossing debut in Sony's history and nearly swung past 2019's 'Avengers: Endgame' for the top domestic launch of all time.

www.hollywoodreporter.com

ETA: As to the Odyssey, not too shabby already grossed 900+ million & by next week will have grossed 1 billion.

These films plus “Michael” all show that audiences will still come out in droves to the movies if it’s the right mix/appeal.