Tolkien and The Long Defeat of the West.

Kieran

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This was an interesting read for me this morning, that when JRR Tolkien wrote his epic myths of the Middle Earth, concluding with victory over Sauron in the Lord of the Rings, his intention wasn’t to create a tale of victory of Good over evil but instead, to describe what he called The Long Defeat. Hopefully you can open this short post from Instagram.

 
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Kieran

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Kieran

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I kind of feel the west is facing this Long defeat, due I’m to our “compassionate” intake of barbaric Islamist hordes who believe in child brides and beheading people on the streets. And due to our weak political systems which have encouraged traitors among us to undermine concepts such as truth and justice and freedom, with their deranged ideas and of course, perpetual “activism” which is little more than fifth columnist manoeuvres.

We are doomed to face a reckoning which we may not survive.
 
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Federberg

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This is fascinating. I'm a huge Tolkien fan. The Hobbit, Lord of the Rings, Silmarillion and Unfinished Tales. I've read all of them, multiple times. If I ever had to pick a specialisation for Mastermind, I might very well pick the world that Tolkien created. But for all of that, I'm largely ignorant of what drove the man. I think you've inspired me to go and study!

I would take issue with your view that the Islamist hordes, and even immigration in the larger context is the problem. I think it's far more insidious than that. I think it's identity politics and the toxic empathy of this movement that's the poison in the body politic of the West. There's a hypothetical scenario where you get the same immigration but it's handled with a more pragmatic acceptance of multi-ethnic societies but a firm understanding that multiculturalism should be resisted. It blows my mind that those on the left have such a lack of common sense that they allow crazy break downs in society. This is what happens when weak men collude with the feminist ideology that seems to dominate the progressive movement. Biden allowing a huge inflow of immigrants was beyond stupid. I might not be the biggest fan of Obama but my goodness that man knew how to faithfully adhere to the law of the land where immigration was concerned. Unfortunately he did other things that made Trump possible, and he IS responsible for Trump. He pushed for Hillary to be the candidate, imagine if Biden had been allowed to take on Trump, none of this would have happened, and I bet you Biden would have won easily. But that wasn't even the worst thing Obama did. Protecting the banks and hedge funds lost the Democrats the industrial heartland, because voters realised that Democrats weren't for the little people anymore. They were willing to provide safe haven for bankers, but didn't give a damn about industries that were decimated by globalisation.

But.. going back to Tolkien.. I find it fascinating that even in a time that we now look back on, the time of post war reconstruction, of high economic growth, full employment. There was a pessimism about the future. I guess we're not quite as unique as we think we are, perhaps that's the deeper lesson in this? There's always a journey, there's always great work that needs to be done to secure a better future
 
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Kieran

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This is fascinating. I'm a huge Tolkien fan. The Hobbit, Lord of the Rings, Silmarillion and Unfinished Tales. I've read all of them, multiple times. If I ever had to pick a specialisation for Mastermind, I might very well pick the world that Tolkien created. But for all of that, I'm largely ignorant of what drove the man. I think you've inspired me to go and study!

I would take issue with your view that the Islamist hordes, and even immigration in the larger context is the problem. I think it's far more insidious than that. I think it's identity politics and the toxic empathy of this movement that's the poison in the body politic of the West. There's a hypothetical scenario where you get the same immigration but it's handled with a more pragmatic acceptance of multi-ethnic societies but a firm understanding that multiculturalism should be resisted. It blows my mind that those on the left have such a lack of common sense that they allow crazy break downs in society. This is what happens when weak men collude with the feminist ideology that seems to dominate the progressive movement. Biden allowing a huge inflow of immigrants was beyond stupid. I might not be the biggest fan of Obama but my goodness that man knew how to faithfully adhere to the law of the land where immigration was concerned. Unfortunately he did other things that made Trump possible, and he IS responsible for Trump. He pushed for Hillary to be the candidate, imagine if Biden had been allowed to take on Trump, none of this would have happened, and I bet you Biden would have won easily. But that wasn't even the worst thing Obama did. Protecting the banks and hedge funds lost the Democrats the industrial heartland, because voters realised that Democrats weren't for the little people anymore. They were willing to provide safe haven for bankers, but didn't give a damn about industries that were decimated by globalisation.

But.. going back to Tolkien.. I find it fascinating that even in a time that we now look back on, the time of post war reconstruction, of high economic growth, full employment. There was a pessimism about the future. I guess we're not quite as unique as we think we are, perhaps that's the deeper lesson in this? There's always a journey, there's always great work that needs to be done to secure a better future
Yeah I read LOTR when I was eighteen and it staggered me. Everything about it, the characters, all the different stages of journey, bombadil, Strider in the pub in Bree,Glorfindel racing up the river to help Frodo, it was epic in every page. I loved the epilogues which told more about Aragorn after the war. Their I’ll fated Trek with Gandalf, “Fly you fools!” I always thought he was a bit unkind here :lol6:, I hadn’t hated anyone yet at that age except McEnroe in 1980 the way I hated Gollum and his tricksy moooching, just everything about it. Boromir’s death. It’s a staggering achievement. I read other related books too but can’t remember which, where I am now. So much wisdom too. Gandalf The wizard sounds like a wizard should, wise and kind. I’m tempted to dig out it out when I get home!

The concept of the long defeat is a very relatable one. We’re facing the two worst ideologies to afflict hummankind, communism and Islamism, both of which are really about violent subjugation and tyranny. Catastrophes for whoever they conquer. Perhaps we’ll make it, but I too am now curious about his thinking…
 
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