2018 Wimbledon men’s SF: Djokovic v Nadal

[DarthFed]

Damn..i was wrong ..my apologies Front..Darth's insight is just as mindless as yours

We shall see brotha. The day will come when your runt is exposed.

 

[the AntiPusher]

This semi finals loss was a real glancing blow to Nadal s plight to be the GOAT ..DARTH you know damn well if that roof was closed he would've slayed Novak.even Novak has acknowledged Rafa deserve to be number One..damn..damn..damn..i am done with this thread

 

[DarthFed]

This semi finals loss was a real glancing blow to Nadal s plight to be the GOAT ..DARTH you know damn well if that roof was closed he would've slayed Novak.even Novak has acknowledged Rafa deserve to be number One..damn..damn..damn..i am done with this thread

He doesn't deserve to be GOAT. And the only reason he's won Wimbledon is due to the fuckwad director's hard-on for long rallies. We all know on real grass he'd have no Wimbledon titles and Fed wouldn't be on a measly 8. He played decent in many ways vs Nole, this wasn't the one-dimensional player from 2008 and 2010 that shamelessly won on the high-bouncing grass. Nadal showed lots of variety and aggressive hitting vs Nole...and it still wasn't enough against an 80% Joker.

 

[the AntiPusher]

He doesn't deserve to be GOAT. And the only reason he's won Wimbledon is due to the fuckwad director's hard-on for long rallies. We all know on real grass he'd have no Wimbledon titles and Fed wouldn't be on a measly 8. He played decent in many ways vs Nole, this wasn't the one-dimensional player from 2008 and 2010 that shamelessly won on the high-bouncing grass. Nadal showed lots of variety and aggressive hitting vs Nole...and it still wasn't enough against an 80% Joker.

80 % djoker...come on brotha..thats so disrespectful. You are a little better than that

 

[DarthFed]

80 % djoker...come on brotha..thats so disrespectful. You are a little better than that

Nah, he isn't all the way back by any measure. He was pretty weak that second day too.

 

[the AntiPusher]

Nah, he isn't all the way back by any measure. He was pretty weak that second day too.

You are really going to stick with the 80%..that’s asinine..There’s not one creditable tennis coach or commentator that would legitimately support such hypocrisy.

 

[DarthFed]

You are really going to stick with the 80%..that’s asinine..There’s not one creditable tennis coach or commentator that would legitimately support such hypocrisy.

That wasn't top shelf Djoker or even close to it. Did you see his ROS on big points or how slow he was moving forward to drop shots. When he got tight he started pushing too.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

When did they remove the silent ban business? Anyways if one of the top guys ever failed a drug test I'm a million % sure we wouldn't hear about it from the ATP.

I completely agree with you. This has nothing to do with Roger or Rafa or Novak. No matter whichever one(s) are doping, if it is known to ATP, I am sure they will try to protect them.

The funny thing is that ATP got all that publicity by saying they are removing silent ban. It means, they should immediately make it public, the moment any player tests positive, without waiting for the investigation to be over. However, they did not actually do so later when some other player tested positive (don't remember the name). But, this is outrageous. There is no body to make them accountable.

 

[Moxie]

Anyone would look flat when they're getting their ass kicked by Roger Federer on a fast hard court.

A 5 set match is now called getting your ass kicked? B-)

 

[Moxie]

I believe Roger's break came after ATP removed the "silent ban" business.

This is the internet posting equivalent of putting your fingers in your ear and going, "LA LA LA LA!"

He had knee surgery...

We all saw him fall flat on his face out of nowhere against Raonic at Wimbledon so something was clearly not right with his knee. Nadal has never had any surgery ever, just dodgy treatments such as PCP and I'm not gonna even bother posting about the performance enhancing effects that has. So at least one of them had surgery which clearly wasn't a silent ban. Not sure about the other though.

Also, I never ever once said I'm sure Roger isn't doping, I said there are no obvious signs such as running around like a maniac all the time and never getting tired and never suffering any signs of fatigue after a long match or 2 beforehand.

I don't see how having surgery is any more valid than being out due to injury. Anyway, he only "said" he had surgery. Same as he said he had mono. See how that works? But here's what bothers me...you guys never get the point, which is not that Roger dopes, but that you guys are hypocrites. Many of the reasons you've used to validate your conviction that Rafa dopes are things that came to pass with Roger in 2017. (And Darth has said that he's convinced Roger never has.) But you put up all of your reasonable arguments and consider it settled. Now, if I were to act like you and Darth (GSM doesn't trade in this business,) I would simply ignore your points and keep on making slurs just to muddy the waters.

So how about this? You guys stop making rude innuendos about Nadal on all kinds of random threads and so will I. Then we can stop derailing threads with these discussions, which go nowhere. If we want to have a doping thread, we can have one. That's my proposal, and no one has to agree with it, obviously. But @mrzz made a Hate Thread to get some of the bile out of the regular threads and I thought that was clever.

 

[Front242]

A 5 set match is now called getting your ass kicked? B-)

It had been discussed earlier that he looked flat at the start though you said he did all match. If it was at the start it was because he was getting his ass kicked and as I said multiple times, it should have been over in 3 sets if not for Roger's famous mid match lapses. Sets 2 and 4 he played like crap and just handed Rafa 2 sets as a sympathy gesture by reverting back to slop and forgetting how he started the match with the aggressive returns and backhands. He won set 3 by 6-1 and shouldn't have let him back in the match in set 2 by playing like crap and it would've then been over. There was no way that should have been a 5 set match.

 

[Moxie]

It had been discussed earlier that he looked flat at the start though you said he did all match. If it was at the start it was because he was getting his ass kicked and as I said multiple times, it should have been over in 3 sets if not for Roger's famous mid match lapses. Sets 2 and 4 he played like crap and just handed Rafa 2 sets as a sympathy gesture by reverting back to slop and forgetting how he started the match with the aggressive returns and backhands. He won set 3 by 6-1 and shouldn't have let him back in the match in set 2 by playing like crap and it would've then been over. There was no way that should have been a 5 set match.

I'm the only one that said he looked flat at the start, though at least Darth confirmed it. I am on record as saying that Roger played better in that match. But we are not debating that match. This is a never-ending swerve from you guys when someone brings up the miraculous Federer Resurgence. The conversation is about doping, and how much you and Darth are convinced that Rafa dopes and Roger doesn't. It is quite clear now that you're afraid to defend your position because it makes Roger look bad, too.

 

[GameSetAndMath]

As far as I know, there are no PEDs that improve someone's backhand, but there are PEDs that improve one's strength, stamina and endurance.

 

[Front242]

I'm the only one that said he looked flat at the start, though at least Darth confirmed it. I am on record as saying that Roger played better in that match. But we are not debating that match. This is a never-ending swerve from you guys when someone brings up the miraculous Federer Resurgence. The conversation is about doping, and how much you and Darth are convinced that Rafa dopes and Roger doesn't. It is quite clear now that you're afraid to defend your position because it makes Roger look bad, too.

Regarding your last sentence above, it's getting a bit boring that you think I'm afraid to defend anything when I already answered that on the last paragraph of post #1089.

 

[Moxie]

Regarding your last sentence above, it's getting a bit boring that you think I'm afraid to defend anything when I already answered that on the last paragraph of post #1089.

Your reply on that post was this:

"He had knee surgery...

We all saw him fall flat on his face out of nowhere against Raonic at Wimbledon so something was clearly not right with his knee. Nadal has never had any surgery ever, just dodgy treatments such as PCP and I'm not gonna even bother posting about the performance enhancing effects that has. So at least one of them had surgery which clearly wasn't a silent ban. Not sure about the other though.

Also, I never ever once said I'm sure Roger isn't doping, I said there are no obvious signs such as running around like a maniac all the time and never getting tired and never suffering any signs of fatigue after a long match or 2 beforehand."
_____
I've really addressed this. What you don't address is your hypocrisy and double-standard. It's fine if you give lip-service to "maybe" Roger has doped, too. But you've never responded to the massive red flags that was Roger coming back from nowhere and winning the AO. Sure, you give an explanation for Roger, but you have in no way admitted that it's very like what you have used to accuse Rafa, over the years. Can you not even admit that if Rafa had done the same your head would have exploded? That's all I'm asking. Just be fair and honest. Or otherwise admit that you have one standard for Nadal, and another for Federer.

 

[Moxie]

As far as I know, there are no PEDs that improve someone's backhand, but there are PEDs that improve one's strength, stamina and endurance.

As far as I know, there are also no PEDs that improve one's serve, but it didn't stop folks from making massive innuendos to the point of outright accusation about Rafa's improved serve in 2010. My point, again, is about double-standards.

I suppose the "increased strength" point could be made about either. However, it's always been hard to argue that Rafa isn't strong enough to serve harder. Roger's bh, on the other hand....

 

[Michael;Kiwi]

Maybe I'm just nieve, but I don't believe any of these players have ever doped at any point. I don't see any evidence that the store tour is doping, like the Tour De France. And once these players got to the top it just seems too risky to their legacies. I also have some faith in the ATP, which seems to be trying.

 

[Michael;Kiwi]

naive

 

[Front242]

As far as I know, there are also no PEDs that improve one's serve, but it didn't stop folks from making massive innuendos to the point of outright accusation about Rafa's improved serve in 2010. My point, again, is about double-standards.

I suppose the "increased strength" point could be made about either. However, it's always been hard to argue that Rafa isn't strong enough to serve harder. Roger's bh, on the other hand....

Are you actually for real with this? Roger changed to a much bigger racquet head but never got the time to practice with it properly which the time off due to injury rehab actually enabled him to get around to finally, but mostly the change was the coach. No coach before Ljubicic fixed the glaring hole in his game which was his backhand and Ivan made him hit it much earlier and with purpose off the return and in rallies.

New racquet with bigger head = way less shanks and now he's hitting it with purpose and earlier DOES NOT = increased strength. His forehand is weak as non alcoholic beer for years now so it's hardly increased strength. Funny as hell reading this from a fan of a player who went from being pretty muscular to having pretty much no muscle left except his quads and left bicep lol.

Btw, it's been well documented before that 2 of Nadal's best seasons (2010 and 2013) followed his PRP treatments which can be abused by shady doctors with HGH injections for very fast healing and this results in numerous performance enhancements, not least of all which is a strength increase. Quite a coincidence really. Feel free to think it was just a grip change though and he never ever used it again. Makes sense.

 

[Front242]

Your reply on that post was this:

"He had knee surgery...

We all saw him fall flat on his face out of nowhere against Raonic at Wimbledon so something was clearly not right with his knee. Nadal has never had any surgery ever, just dodgy treatments such as PCP and I'm not gonna even bother posting about the performance enhancing effects that has. So at least one of them had surgery which clearly wasn't a silent ban. Not sure about the other though.

Also, I never ever once said I'm sure Roger isn't doping, I said there are no obvious signs such as running around like a maniac all the time and never getting tired and never suffering any signs of fatigue after a long match or 2 beforehand."
_____
I've really addressed this. What you don't address is your hypocrisy and double-standard. It's fine if you give lip-service to "maybe" Roger has doped, too. But you've never responded to the massive red flags that was Roger coming back from nowhere and winning the AO. Sure, you give an explanation for Roger, but you have in no way admitted that it's very like what you have used to accuse Rafa, over the years. Can you not even admit that if Rafa had done the same your head would have exploded? That's all I'm asking. Just be fair and honest. Or otherwise admit that you have one standard for Nadal, and another for Federer.

I don't see any massive red flag personally. If his movement was up to par he had a very high chance of making the semis anyway with the current weak competition and with Djokovic losing to Istomin and Murray to Mischa Zverev it made things much easier. You seem to have conveniently forgotten Federer struggled with 5 set matches versus Nishikori and Wawrinka so it's not like he won the whole thing without dropping a set...

Finally, he beat Nadal by being much more aggressive, especially with the backhand, which let's face it is the reason most Nadal fans get angry even thinking about it. But the most overlooked factor by all of the Federer haters is the one that should actually be most obvious: the surface change. The much faster surface contributed to not only Federer winning as he's the best fast court player on tour, but also to Djokovic losing super early to Istomin and the extra court speed meant Zverev knocked moping Murray out early too. Clearly, the surface change was the most glaringly obvious reason for all of this.

Be thankful to the ATP for ruining the sport and having practically all the courts play at the same shitty, slow speed which has enabled your guy win way more than he otherwise would. If the grass at Wimbledon played like it should and the USO was a proper medium/fast hard court, you'd be accusing Federer of even more doping as he'd be the clear favourite at both even at almost 37. As it currently stands, he's only got one surface which plays decent speed, the AO, and that's only since the surface speed up in 2017. Both Nadal and Djokovic have 3 slow slams now tailor made for them...